Ah of course. A swaging die. I was calling what I wanted a dimple die. That's what I need for the floor of the 304, there are a few of them and the grommet/plug is a sort of top hat shape so that the outer lip sits inside the recess and the body of the plug protrudes through the floor. If I can't bodge anything I assume it was johnny bravo who made it for you?
Post by toomanyprojects on Oct 17, 2022 16:16:31 GMT
Some unexpected progress on the Celica last week, a certain something that I've been 'chasing' for three years has nearly come to fruition thanks to having a handy local rep (thank you again crouchieb ), many beers owed!
Allow me to explain a bit more.
The Celica rear boot floor and wheel well currently looks like this
Mmmmmmm both frilly and holey, but excellent drainage qualities!
Now way back when in early 2019, when we didn't know what Covid was, the celica was in a barn far, far away, and I was getting stuck in on a more regular basis (something I hope to rectify soon now the seasons have changed). I was at the time posting about my efforts to either repair or find a replacement boot floor, I was even considering alternatives such as a donor arrangement from an Astra G of all things. An unbeknown to me at the time thread reader sent me a message kindly offering a good boot floor from one of two donor shells he was using to piece together his own project TA22. Unfortunately thanks to logistics, covid, more logistics, and a number of other reasons it's just never quite come off. Until last week...
A chance spot of timing and the efforts of crouchieb means that this is now awaiting delivery to this part of the world.
So while there may be a bit of surface rust, I 'think'/hope it's a heck of a lot more solid than what I currently have. I may even be able to use it as a bigger repair for the other areas that have also vanished with the tin worm over the chassis legs or as a template in some areas at the very least. I've started to think how I might be able to drill out the existing floor and then replace as a bigger piece but I'll only really know what I've got once it's in hand. More on that soon hopefully.
With that bit of good news it's bizarrely given me a bit of a lift to get on with the rest of the car once more, so much so I found myself in the workshop on saturday working on the car... although that didn't last quite as long as I hoped as SWMBO's daily failed it's MOT on lack of headlight adjustment (internal adjuster had sheared) and to get at the unit the front bumper needed removal (?!?!) then on sunday she wanted to head to Sandringham for a show there this weekend.
Hopefully some more time in the eves playing instead now the jobs in the garden have dwindled.
Some unexpected progress on the Celica last week, a certain something that I've been 'chasing' for three years has nearly come to fruition thanks to having a handy local rep (thank you again crouchieb ), many beers owed!
A chance spot of timing and the efforts of crouchieb means that this is now awaiting delivery to this part of the world.
You’re welcome. Delivery of boot floor scheduled for next week and to coincide with disappearance of the aforementioned beers!
Post by grumpynorthener on Oct 17, 2022 19:44:10 GMT
Nice when plans come together - looks like the nearside area of the boot floor area is good but the offside is somewhat ropey - From experience the best place to cut / weld the panel is on the top radius edge of the spare wheel well - I appreciate that you will want to incorporate the boot floor section to the offside but for the rest & where possible if cut & welded on the radius edge you be able to control any heat distortion from welding much easier than on a flat panel section - It will also be much easier to dress back and should only require a skim of filler to disguise the welded seam
Post by toomanyprojects on Dec 13, 2022 16:16:56 GMT
Is everyone sitting down? Good. I May have done 'something' on the Celica... I know, I know
Asides the quick play with the shrinker and stretcher for the windscreen/roof repairs (see workshop thread here)
So starting with the ethos of just doing 'something', my plan was to start on the panel making once more where there are, errr, 'issues'. Slowly, slowly, catchy monkey and all that.
It all started simply enough, a spot of CAD that resulted in a couple of strips of new metal
before shaping up
it was then time to deal with the 'issue'
a bit of drilling, slicing and dicing later and we get the following.
Lovely!
It's now decision time, in an ideal world I need to go further as it all needs a bit of attention. This top rail was apart in the very early days but the repairs made then are far from ideal and I 'think' can be done better
My thinking is to drill everything out, dismantle as far as is necessary, then build back up replacing and repairing as I go. Especially as I need to repair the rail on the bonnet side also
You'll also notice from the above the wing under the front battery tray, not pretty. Another area to cut out and repair then. Perhaps I ought to add a swaging tool to my xmas list...
My thinking is to drill everything out, dismantle as far as is necessary, then build back up replacing and repairing as I go. Especially as I need to repair the rail on the bonnet side also
Now what was it that I was saying...
Ahh yes, drilling...
Oh and cutting...
A few hours spent carefully unpicking the previous repairs resulted in things slowly coming apart
Scary as it might look I think it's the right course of action as I'm sure with a bit of time and patience I can do a better job.
There is also the minor matter that I couldn't really leave it as it was judging by what was underneath
With it off the shell, I can repair and pattern from the section that meets the suspension turret
Once the bottom plate was removed, it left the wing top, or what was now left of it, in a bit of a sorry state
the more I removed however, the more my choice of action was justified... it's really not pretty wherever you look!
In a quirky similarity to the MG design, there is a shelf behind the front wheels that collects the dirt/muck and slowly rots through. Although it's not completely disintegrated it does need attention which is going to be bl**dy awkward but needs must.
Not quite sure how I'm going to tackle things as yet so some thought may be required, as ever, advice very welcome.
Doesnt look too bad, im no professional but take lots of pictures/measurements, do one panel at a time so its not too daunting, shape bits of wood for formers and dont go too thick with the replacement metal, thats all I can offer!
Post by grumpynorthener on Jan 4, 2023 21:54:32 GMT
Sam - My first point of call from here would be to do a tap assessment - blunt chisel ended panel hammer and go around all the suspect areas with a light to moderate tap - soft / weak areas will just hole through or split - the stronger areas will stand up to this assessment and its pointless cutting out & replacing the stronger areas even if they do have signs of rust pitting - Has gtviva stated tackle one section at time although this is quite often tricky because like you have already done you may have to cut & remove sections to gain access to the repair areas in the first place. Whilst appreciating that you want to undertake a through & professional type repair its pointless being a hero with the repairs that are awkward in shape and hold multiple compound faces / curvatures - Nothing wrong in making the repair panel up in 2 or 3 sections as required - may appear a faff but its far easier than attempting to make up a difficult repair panel when you don't have access to a English wheel / box pan folder / press equipment - Whilst heat on sheet steel may bring problems of distortion it can also help you when forming in areas of tight radius or in complex swaged areas - keep posting the images up and just shout if you require any further advice
Doesnt look too bad, im no professional but take lots of pictures/measurements, do one panel at a time so its not too daunting, shape bits of wood for formers and dont go too thick with the replacement metal, thats all I can offer!
Sam - My first point of call from here would be to do a tap assessment - blunt chisel ended panel hammer and go around all the suspect areas with a light to moderate tap - soft / weak areas will just hole through or split - the stronger areas will stand up to this assessment and its pointless cutting out & replacing the stronger areas even if they do have signs of rust pitting - Has gtviva stated tackle one section at time although this is quite often tricky because like you have already done you may have to cut & remove sections to gain access to the repair areas in the first place. Whilst appreciating that you want to undertake a through & professional type repair its pointless being a hero with the repairs that are awkward in shape and hold multiple compound faces / curvatures - Nothing wrong in making the repair panel up in 2 or 3 sections as required - may appear a faff but its far easier than attempting to make up a difficult repair panel when you don't have access to a English wheel / box pan folder / press equipment - Whilst heat on sheet steel may bring problems of distortion it can also help you when forming in areas of tight radius or in complex swaged areas - keep posting the images up and just shout if you require any further advice
Good advice, many thanks gents.
I think slowly, slowly is the way forward here, I'm going to make up the simple panels first while they are off the car and can be simply done, then we can move on to the fun stuff. As you say Chris, doing things in sections may be the way to go. A metal folder may just now be on the birthday list for the end of the month however
Post by toomanyprojects on Jan 9, 2023 18:05:38 GMT
Another update?! and so soon? Yes readers, it would appear miracles do happen . plus I promised myself I needed to do something before getting distracted with a trip to the Bicester Scramble the following day.
On with sorting this mess then
Trying to stick to my slowly, slowly mantra it was time to have a Blue Peter afternoon - lots of cutting and sticking. Must confess it was rather therapeutic.
My thinking was to use the existing wing top as a guide to provide templates for the sections I need to fabricate, I can then just flip/reverse the templates to provide the right orientation for the bits that are, errr, 'missing'. Many boxes of Kellogg's finest were harmed in the making of said templates.
Given the boxes I had to hand were shorter than the sections I needed to make, I had to do them in several stages, starting with the underside
This could then be transferred to another sheet where the additional width for a fold could be added
Which when the rear section was added as well...
Should result in something much better than the quick lash up fitted previously
A quick rub (no sniggering at the back) on the various drain holes and openings gave me the shapes to be cut out in time
Then it was a case of repeating the same process for the top
the outer side
and the inner wing/engine bay side
Which resulted in a nice set of templates
that fitted together like so
Last job was to remove the remnants of what was left from my previous unpicking
I've left the section behind the turret for now as I still need to pattern that bit and wanted to do that before it was removed. It's too thin/perforated so needs to go, so I marked my cut line as a guide
As you can see in the centre of the above photo, there are also some holes below that line that I'll have to do some localised repairs on.
Nice work, good to see you getting back to this one!
Many thanks Alex.
I won't lie the mojo took a bit of a hit on this one, combined with the move and plenty of other distractions it was too easy to give this one a miss rather than face the issues. Scary to think it's been 2.5 years since I really did anything on it. Time flies!
Feels good to be stuck back in again though and hopefully a bit of a push this year should see some pleasing progress once more. I'm not looking forward to the screen surround and roof repairs though!
I find that welding projects can be quite daunting. Simply in the amount of work involved and the risks associated with them. The many layers that often need to be peeled back before one can start rebuilding. All the while risking losing references/templates etc. And this is even when people involved can at least weld and there is at least something left to template. I'm always in awe of those who tackle these type of projects, like you. Things like moving houses and the like always have a big impact on life anyway... So well done for doing all you do, juggling several projects as well!
Post by toomanyprojects on Jan 11, 2023 17:24:04 GMT
Some more minor progress last night albeit with a slight distraction that I'll come on to.
Main task was to finish templating the last section to be removed around the suspension turret
Essentially to get it to a rough form/curve similar to the offside
Once relatively happy it was how I wanted it, I dug out one of the wings to ensure the profile roughly matched that of the wing.
All looks reasonable to me. Given that's the only datum I have, before cutting the last section out I'll take some measurements and compare them to the other side also and that should give me the correct height to aim at with the repair piece.
I've a relatively clear weekend coming up so hoping I'll be able to start making the sections up in metal... well assuming last night's slight distraction doesn't get any worse
Yeah that doesn't look particularly clever!
There was evidence of it also running down and dripping further down and I found other puddles in the far corner of the workshop. From an initial look, I suspect it's coming from the join between the buildings/roofs but need to get on the roof to investigate more. With the wind and driving rain we've had recently it could have come from anywhere. Another job on the to do list though
Post by toomanyprojects on Jan 16, 2023 12:02:53 GMT
Well in a turn of good fortune despite the best efforts of the weather, the ceiling didn't fall down, so this chicken licken left it well alone for the time being for fear of opening a can of worms! That and it would be yet another distraction... not this weekend!
I had other plans to turn the floor into a right state
Post by toomanyprojects on Jan 16, 2023 16:51:56 GMT
Time to transfer my CAD templates to metal then
A bit of careful cutting out with the grinder and slitting disc later
It was then on to the time consuming stage - forming and shaping everything. The trickiest being the side piece which has an indent as well as curves up at the end to meet the top section that the wing bolts to. Given that I had a jog sat there in the form of the O/S I thought I'd start with that.
A bit of time with the shrinker/stretcher to get the right movements resulted in things shaping up () nicely.
On with refining some of the other sections then, the bottom piece is relatively straightforward asides two cutouts, one at the side to mirror the, err side piece, and one at the end, because err, Toyota.
which meant I could test fit things together
and would go on the car like so
Not a bad position to get to given I only had a few hours on Sat. However the top piece niggled me, it just wasn't right and needed fettling both in terms of it's profile around the side curve and length, in an ideal world it would tuck under the last rectangular section I'd previously made to mirror the other side. Having slept on it there was only one option...
Back out with the templating
The rest by this point though I was rather pleased with
New top made, shaped, and a stepped section added at the bulkhead end saw a much better outcome
Time to lose the clamps and replace with cleco pins in order to check everything
Pretty happy with that, now I could do so, it was time to check with the wing in place
all seemed to sit as intended - happy days.
A bit more fettling saw things improve further but I was still battling against some of the old metal that I'd left in place as a reference, particularly behind the suspension turret and at both ends where the wing meets the slam panel and where the top rail joins the bulkhead
Time to swallow a couple then and breakout the spot drill once more
Yeah that wasn't doing much!
That left me with this
Nothing for it but to have a clean up, see what was still solid enough to work with, and then build up once more. This time in final position
This also meant I needed to bring the existing join to the suspension turret into play
Which could be fixed like so
Marked using the top piece to give me a join line
and trimmed
Very pleased with that and much better than what I started out with.
Before all gets fixed in place I've a few other localised repairs to make as well where the metal has thinned and perforated
Then it will be on to the front sorting out the mess of crash damage/leaking battery/previous attempts at solidifying things
It's all got to just come out and get remade I think... just not sure quite how I'm going to tackle it just yet.
The other areas will just get small repairs to strengthen them back up
I'll finish making those small bits up and progress can then resume once I've requisitioned my welder back from her ladyship. Sods law states that as soon as I start it'll run out of gas!
It's certainly not pretty and it always takes far longer than I think it should, but I must confess it feels good to be stuck in once again.
Post by grumpynorthener on Jan 16, 2023 19:16:39 GMT
Hmm - That battery tray area certainly needs to come out you could make a simple castellated type timber former to shape a piece of sheet steel into - then using a hardwood timber form to tap the swaged area down into - use a piece of sheet steel larger than you need as it will reduce in size as you form it - you will also have to fasten the sheet down to the former somehow - maybe through the centre and work outwards in both directions - might need a practice piece first - Nice to see the rest of that inner wing progress though